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	<title>Comments on: End mills vs. router bits for mortising</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/2009/07/11/end-mills-vs-router-bits-for-mortising/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/2009/07/11/end-mills-vs-router-bits-for-mortising/</link>
	<description>inside the woodshop</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 06 Feb 2012 03:10:48 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/2009/07/11/end-mills-vs-router-bits-for-mortising/#comment-34152</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Mar 2011 00:30:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/?p=429#comment-34152</guid>
		<description>No problem, Jeff! To chuck the 3/8" shank in your router, you have two options.

For many routers, including the DW 625, a 3/8" collet is available. That is the best option. 

An alternative [and there is no other choice that I am aware of for 5/16" (8mm) end mills] is to use a collet reducer. This is a sleeve which fits into your 1/2" collet and fills the gap for the smaller shank bit.

The disadvantage of a collet reducer is that it introduces more stiffness to the collet assembly and therefore the chuck needs to be tightened very snugly to keep a good grip on the bit. The better collet reducers are more flexible.

Infinity Tools sells reducers with six grooves in the wall for flexibility:
http://www.infinitytools.com/3_8-Router-Collet-Reducing-Sleeve/productinfo/SLV-003/ 

Whiteside also makes reducers, available directly from them or from Woodcraft:
http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/2008167/9245/12-to-38-Router-Bit-Shank-Adapter-Whiteside-6402.aspx

Lee Valley also sells reducers, but note that the 1/2-3/8 reducer has only one split and is therefore rather stiff. It also has no lip, so it inconveniently tends to slide too far into the main router collet.
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=30126&#038;cat=1,46168,46180

Good luck with your mortising. Take small depth increments, and listen and feel for signs of cutting stress.

Rob</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No problem, Jeff! To chuck the 3/8&#8243; shank in your router, you have two options.</p>
<p>For many routers, including the DW 625, a 3/8&#8243; collet is available. That is the best option. </p>
<p>An alternative [and there is no other choice that I am aware of for 5/16" (8mm) end mills] is to use a collet reducer. This is a sleeve which fits into your 1/2&#8243; collet and fills the gap for the smaller shank bit.</p>
<p>The disadvantage of a collet reducer is that it introduces more stiffness to the collet assembly and therefore the chuck needs to be tightened very snugly to keep a good grip on the bit. The better collet reducers are more flexible.</p>
<p>Infinity Tools sells reducers with six grooves in the wall for flexibility:<br />
<a href="http://www.infinitytools.com/3_8-Router-Collet-Reducing-Sleeve/productinfo/SLV-003/" rel="nofollow">http://www.infinitytools.com/3_8-Router-Collet-Reducing-Sleeve/productinfo/SLV-003/</a> </p>
<p>Whiteside also makes reducers, available directly from them or from Woodcraft:<br />
<a href="http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/2008167/9245/12-to-38-Router-Bit-Shank-Adapter-Whiteside-6402.aspx" rel="nofollow">http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/2008167/9245/12-to-38-Router-Bit-Shank-Adapter-Whiteside-6402.aspx</a></p>
<p>Lee Valley also sells reducers, but note that the 1/2-3/8 reducer has only one split and is therefore rather stiff. It also has no lip, so it inconveniently tends to slide too far into the main router collet.<br />
<a href="http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=30126&#038;cat=1,46168,46180" rel="nofollow">http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=30126&#038;cat=1,46168,46180</a></p>
<p>Good luck with your mortising. Take small depth increments, and listen and feel for signs of cutting stress.</p>
<p>Rob</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Jeff</title>
		<link>http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/2009/07/11/end-mills-vs-router-bits-for-mortising/#comment-34028</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Mar 2011 04:51:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/?p=429#comment-34028</guid>
		<description>Sorry for being ignorant, what am I missing here? I have collets for 1/4" and 1/2". How do I put a 3/8" mill end in my router?   Thanks!   Jeff Jones, Battle Ground, WA</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry for being ignorant, what am I missing here? I have collets for 1/4&#8243; and 1/2&#8243;. How do I put a 3/8&#8243; mill end in my router?   Thanks!   Jeff Jones, Battle Ground, WA</p>
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		<title>By: hartzou</title>
		<link>http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/2009/07/11/end-mills-vs-router-bits-for-mortising/#comment-4659</link>
		<dc:creator>hartzou</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Feb 2010 01:39:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/?p=429#comment-4659</guid>
		<description>Very useful information. Thank you for your writing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very useful information. Thank you for your writing.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/2009/07/11/end-mills-vs-router-bits-for-mortising/#comment-3514</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 04:17:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/?p=429#comment-3514</guid>
		<description>Hi Peter,

Thank you for the kind words and for reading.

The end mills that I have found work well are classified as:
Single, Standard, Center-cutting, Uncoated, Four-flute, Solid carbide, Plain shank, 30-degree helix.

An example is item #85315240, a 3/8 diameter end mill, from MSC Industrial Supply.

http://www1.mscdirect.com/cgi/nnsrhm

Click on End Mills, etc in the Big Book Index pages on the left. Then Single End Mills in section 3, then Standard.

In the drop-down lists, select Four-flute, Solid Carbide. 

THEN put in the size parameters: cut diameter, shank diameter, overall length, and cutting length.

Now you've got 1-2 dozen bits to examine. You are looking for center-cutting and uncoated (coating is OK but not necessary for wood and costs more). I would avoid selecting brand, type, and coating from the drop-down lists because you may exclude some bits that you will want to consider. Just look over the list and look for center-cutting and uncoated.

This is what works for me. 

Rob</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Peter,</p>
<p>Thank you for the kind words and for reading.</p>
<p>The end mills that I have found work well are classified as:<br />
Single, Standard, Center-cutting, Uncoated, Four-flute, Solid carbide, Plain shank, 30-degree helix.</p>
<p>An example is item #85315240, a 3/8 diameter end mill, from MSC Industrial Supply.</p>
<p><a href="http://www1.mscdirect.com/cgi/nnsrhm" rel="nofollow">http://www1.mscdirect.com/cgi/nnsrhm</a></p>
<p>Click on End Mills, etc in the Big Book Index pages on the left. Then Single End Mills in section 3, then Standard.</p>
<p>In the drop-down lists, select Four-flute, Solid Carbide. </p>
<p>THEN put in the size parameters: cut diameter, shank diameter, overall length, and cutting length.</p>
<p>Now you&#8217;ve got 1-2 dozen bits to examine. You are looking for center-cutting and uncoated (coating is OK but not necessary for wood and costs more). I would avoid selecting brand, type, and coating from the drop-down lists because you may exclude some bits that you will want to consider. Just look over the list and look for center-cutting and uncoated.</p>
<p>This is what works for me. </p>
<p>Rob</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Peter</title>
		<link>http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/2009/07/11/end-mills-vs-router-bits-for-mortising/#comment-3513</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 02:12:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/?p=429#comment-3513</guid>
		<description>first, I enjoy your postings. Well written. I don't often take the time to read woodworking blogs but I look forward to yours. 

I searched the manufacturers for end mills but the selection is so confusing I have no idea which ones to order. Can you be more specific on which ones you use?

Peter</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>first, I enjoy your postings. Well written. I don&#8217;t often take the time to read woodworking blogs but I look forward to yours. </p>
<p>I searched the manufacturers for end mills but the selection is so confusing I have no idea which ones to order. Can you be more specific on which ones you use?</p>
<p>Peter</p>
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		<title>By: Fred Nussbaum</title>
		<link>http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/2009/07/11/end-mills-vs-router-bits-for-mortising/#comment-2746</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred Nussbaum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Oct 2009 21:27:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/?p=429#comment-2746</guid>
		<description>Great thread; very informative. Thanks.

Fred</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great thread; very informative. Thanks.</p>
<p>Fred</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/2009/07/11/end-mills-vs-router-bits-for-mortising/#comment-2234</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Sep 2009 23:06:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/?p=429#comment-2234</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the information, Jeff. It's helpful to hear from someone with your background. 

I haven't had problems with burning the wood but I cut the mortise in shallow steps and I clear out the chips regularly. For making a 3/8" mortise in a dense wood like bubinga, I'll take probably about 10 passes to cut a 1 1/4" deep mortise. I listen and feel for signs of strain from the bit or router, but it goes nice and smoothly.

Rob</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the information, Jeff. It&#8217;s helpful to hear from someone with your background. </p>
<p>I haven&#8217;t had problems with burning the wood but I cut the mortise in shallow steps and I clear out the chips regularly. For making a 3/8&#8243; mortise in a dense wood like bubinga, I&#8217;ll take probably about 10 passes to cut a 1 1/4&#8243; deep mortise. I listen and feel for signs of strain from the bit or router, but it goes nice and smoothly.</p>
<p>Rob</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Jeff</title>
		<link>http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/2009/07/11/end-mills-vs-router-bits-for-mortising/#comment-2228</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Sep 2009 17:19:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/?p=429#comment-2228</guid>
		<description>Well, I havn't done much wood working yet, but I've milled lots of steel.  My google search today was to discover why endmills are not typically used in woodworking.  This article convinces me there is no good reason other than marketing and the typical woodworker's lack of exposure to metalworking tools.  I wanted to coment on the previously mentioned speed concern with endmills.....the only speed limitation is due to heat.  Modern cnc machining centers (for milling metal) have spindle speeds upwards of 20,000 rpm.  It is the surface speed at the circumference of the tool and the resulting heat generated that becomes the limiting factor.....smaller tool can run infinitly faster than a large one.  This probably isn't as much of a concern with wood.  I imagine the wood will burn before harming the carbide cutter.  HSS endmills would probably need to be run an order of magnitude slower [than carbide] to prevent their demise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, I havn&#8217;t done much wood working yet, but I&#8217;ve milled lots of steel.  My google search today was to discover why endmills are not typically used in woodworking.  This article convinces me there is no good reason other than marketing and the typical woodworker&#8217;s lack of exposure to metalworking tools.  I wanted to coment on the previously mentioned speed concern with endmills&#8230;..the only speed limitation is due to heat.  Modern cnc machining centers (for milling metal) have spindle speeds upwards of 20,000 rpm.  It is the surface speed at the circumference of the tool and the resulting heat generated that becomes the limiting factor&#8230;..smaller tool can run infinitly faster than a large one.  This probably isn&#8217;t as much of a concern with wood.  I imagine the wood will burn before harming the carbide cutter.  HSS endmills would probably need to be run an order of magnitude slower [than carbide] to prevent their demise.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/2009/07/11/end-mills-vs-router-bits-for-mortising/#comment-1780</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 19 Jul 2009 21:25:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/?p=429#comment-1780</guid>
		<description>Hi Tico,

Thanks for the comment. I am glad you find the posts useful. 

I have not used a slot mortiser. The current issue (#206) of Fine Woodworking has a nice review of mortising methods. My go-to method is the plunge router with a template guide that rides in a slot jig. These have all been shop-made jigs, but lately I'm finding the Mortise Pal to be handy. I truly get virtually no vibration or error with this method - unless, of course, I make a mistake (and that happens more than I should admit.)

Rob</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Tico,</p>
<p>Thanks for the comment. I am glad you find the posts useful. </p>
<p>I have not used a slot mortiser. The current issue (#206) of Fine Woodworking has a nice review of mortising methods. My go-to method is the plunge router with a template guide that rides in a slot jig. These have all been shop-made jigs, but lately I&#8217;m finding the Mortise Pal to be handy. I truly get virtually no vibration or error with this method - unless, of course, I make a mistake (and that happens more than I should admit.)</p>
<p>Rob</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: tico vogt</title>
		<link>http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/2009/07/11/end-mills-vs-router-bits-for-mortising/#comment-1726</link>
		<dc:creator>tico vogt</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Jul 2009 12:33:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.rpwoodwork.com/blog/?p=429#comment-1726</guid>
		<description>Hi Rob,

As usual, a well written and useful entry. It is interesting to me to read your pieces because I am at the point in my small shop work where focusing on small refinements is the order of the day, and you have mentioned many of them in your blog.

The morticing jig for plunge routers that Tage Frid described in his technique book has served me very well, but quality slot morticers have always been in the back of my mind as machines that might be a subtantial step up in quality, eliminating that last bit of vibration and error introduced by a hand held and controlled tool such as the plunge router. Are end mills used in those machines? Have you ever used one?

Best,

Tico</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Rob,</p>
<p>As usual, a well written and useful entry. It is interesting to me to read your pieces because I am at the point in my small shop work where focusing on small refinements is the order of the day, and you have mentioned many of them in your blog.</p>
<p>The morticing jig for plunge routers that Tage Frid described in his technique book has served me very well, but quality slot morticers have always been in the back of my mind as machines that might be a subtantial step up in quality, eliminating that last bit of vibration and error introduced by a hand held and controlled tool such as the plunge router. Are end mills used in those machines? Have you ever used one?</p>
<p>Best,</p>
<p>Tico</p>
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